Stern Pinball

"That thing probably costs Stern Pinball to make that in China less than $5. And they're selling it for $200."

John Wick shooter knob is overpriced plastic that costs $5 to make but sells for $200

"I think we all need to come to terms with the fact that Stern is gonna remake all of those hit DMD games eventually. I mean it. Eventually they will do it"

Stern will eventually remake all hit DMD games as remasters

"King Kong is gonna be $3,000 more than freaking Godzilla was. Do you think it's gonna have 3,000 more in it when it comes to mechs, bomb and toys and everything? I don't know."

King Kong LE pricing criticism - $3000 more than Godzilla without justification

"When you look at Stern Pinball launches, they have hits and they have misses. Every game is not consistently good. Every game has different levels of code. Every game brings you different levels of theme popularity, different levels of mechanical magic."

Stern Pinball has inconsistent quality across releases with hits and misses

"Stern Pinball, every three to four months, puts out a new game and they have everything from music to comics to movies to D&D. Like they've got something for everybody."

Stern Pinball has the best variety and most consistent output in pinball

"I am shocked that Stern Pinball has not invited like 20 X-Men owners into Stern Pinball, fly them over and say, hey, look, we've been reading your feedback on Pinside, you have a lot of really interesting ideas on how to make this game better, we're committed to making this game better"

Stern Pinball shows arrogance by not engaging with X-Men buyers who are concerned about the game's future

"Stern Pinball wasn't able to test the final version of that cable and the node board in the game and has passed that on to customers without proper testing."

Stern's quality control is inadequate - they're shipping untested final production versions

"It's a problem for Stern Pinball. They really messed this whole thing up. The LE's never used to lose value. It used to be the place where the collectors got handed something that was ascending in value. And now it's like, gosh, it's so painful to see this that the Pro is now the smartest and wisest place to financially put your Stern money"

Stern LE strategy is broken - Pros now hold value better

"you abused your position as a pinball company releasing that basic game for twenty thousand dollars it was a slap in the face to everyone who collects pinball"

Stern's James Bond 60 pricing was abusive to collectors

"Your Stern pinball and you're inviting these pinball media into Stern pinball to play the game for the first time. And that's great. But here's what they're doing wrong. And I mean this. And it's so stupid."

Stern's media day format is unprofessional and poorly executed

"That is the worst thing Stern Pinball could do right now. Because what I don't think Seth understands is I think they're finally getting closer to where they need to be to justify these prices."

Stern cannot afford to raise prices again

"I think some of us secretly want Stern Pinball, maybe not even secretly, maybe publicly. I think a lot of us sort of want Stern to learn a lesson that you took prices too high, that you burned a lot of LE collectors with the remakes."

People secretly want Stern to learn a lesson about high pricing and LE remakes

"Modern Stern pricing is where it's at because we're paying for that humongous factory they moved into. And since they've been in that big factory, they haven't been cranking out hit after hit after hit. The IP and the licenses they've been bringing the market haven't been big enough to support that kind of factory. And I think Stern's in a little bit of trouble."

Stern Pinball is in trouble due to high factory costs and lack of hit themes

"Stern Pinball showed me in this game that they can create a mechanical thing that is embarrassing anything we've seen mechanically from Jersey Jack"

Stern's dragon mechanism embarrasses anything Jersey Jack has made mechanically

"I think they've absolutely abandoned the home buyer the home collector which actually makes up more of their sales. And I think they made a lot of really greedy moves."

Stern is winning but their win streak is over due to abandoning home collectors

"They're not going to snake me stern. I know what your plans are. You're going to try to show this game without me ready... I wish they would let us know so as content creators could like actually plan."

Frustration with Stern revealing game early without proper notice to content creators

"you guys are making the pros two nice. You're making the pros way too nice the artwork is way too nice on the pro the pro should be as pedestrian they should be sand bagging what the cabinet artwork on the pro is like instead they idiotically sometimes make the pro artwork even better. Then the damn premium"

Stern makes Pro cabinet artwork too nice - should be more basic

"stern animations are a joke compared to Jersey Jack and spooky I don't agree with that Engleberg Humper Denk from Princess Brad I think you're wrong on that you think spooky animations are better than the stuff that's happening in X-Men and in Godzilla and in no spooky animations are not better than Stern there's not a single spooky game with better animations JJP's animations are really good"

Stern animations are not inferior to Spooky, but JJP has good animations due to their big screen

"stern should be flying you guys to Vegas a special guest of CES they should put you up in hotel rooms. And they should actually roll out the red carpet for the main content creators for their industry that's what everybody else does in the tech world that's what everyone else is doing all my friends in tech media are going to CES"

Media should not pay their own way to Stern reveals - company should treat them like tech industry does

"Stern's whole model requires them to have a an LE everybody wants because if they don't get FOMO around the LE, then distras and dealers don't need to like order their bulk order"

Stern's business model requires LE FOMO and this game won't deliver it

"how are you gonna handle making a better version of Ghostbusters than all those thousands of people who have the original one are now gonna have what? A game worth a lot less, a game that doesn't play as well as the new one. And you're gonna just burn them the way you burn the Metallica owners"

Stern's remake strategy hurts existing owners

"A stern is a stern is a stern. So you know, like just remember who's making this game. I find it hard to believe that stern is going to go above and beyond and throw so much into this game and not fall back on flat plastics all throughout the game."

Critical of Stern's typical approach and doubts they'll deliver truly innovative features

"I also think all pinball content creators should have their own webinar. So we could see this game without having to travel. And if Stern pinball wants us to travel, I think they should pay for the travel... Jersey Jack pinball did the right thing and set up everybody with not just travel, but hotel room. I think Jersey Jack gave us somewhere around like $800 to book our travel to go see Avatar."

Stern should pay for content creator travel like Jersey Jack does

"I heard Stern pinball has the license for Super Mario Brothers."

Stern has Super Mario Brothers license

"So you heard it here first. I'm here to tell you right now. I heard Stern pinball has the license for Super Mario Brothers. So you start to think about that for a minute, right? Maybe they have Pokemon and Super Mario."

Prediction: Stern pinball has the license for Super Mario Brothers, and maybe also has Pokemon.

"In a two and a half year period of $4,000 increase in the price of a Stern LE. And they doubled the amount of the games... This is where I think we're going to look back years from now and wonder where the beginnings of the pinball market collapse begin."

Stern Pinball engaged in systematic price gouging over 4 years

"I think Stern is in jeopardy right now. And I mean this, of completely losing all of the new in-box market for its product."

Stern Pinball needs a hit game at CES or risks losing the NIB market

"A stern premium being $9,500 Is kind of just like ludicrous... $9,500 if you want the full featured Stern pinball machine... That's silly and stupid"

Stern's pricing strategy is driving away customers and hurting the hobby

"I think they need to stop thinking like they need to attract new audiences. And they need to double down on why we love pinball in the first place... Not try to attract these young kids who have no money into their hobby and stop wasting so much time with the Stern army and location play and all these badges."

Stern Pinball needs to focus on making amazing products for existing pinball fans rather than trying to attract new young audiences

"I think Stern pinball has screwed over all these guys. The old guard of pinball distributors, they're all getting screwed over because what Stern has done recently is they've invited so many new dealers into the fold."

Stern Pinball has screwed over distributors with their bundling practices and allocation to new dealers

"Anyone who unboxes a modern Stern LE that's not made by Keith Elwin is going to lose $3,000 or more. It's just that simple. Every single one. You can't name me one $13,000 Stern LE that is not a Keith Elwin game that has not lost $3,000 to $4,000 in just a year."

Modern Stern LEs not made by Keith Elwin lose $3000+ in value within a year

"when you look at the second hand value of most of these new Stern machines, they're abysmal. They're absolutely abysmal."

Stern's secondhand values are abysmal and getting worse

"if we remade Lord of the Rings and just did it right, you're talking 5,000 units easily if you remake Lord of the Rings. It's these new games to them that are really painful."

Stern should focus on remastering classic hits rather than new themes

"I think Stern's issues are all because, as an organization, they don't have a chief marketing officer doing his or her job. They just, they need to build a marketing department."

Stern Pinball lacks proper marketing leadership and strategy

"They brought in a consultancy and they did focus groups on what games they should make to bring in the next generation of pinball enthusiasts. This is a true story. And when they put back to the future in front of them, it didn't hit because they, those kids, aren't in love with it."

Stern passed on Back to the Future due to focus group consultancy rather than designer input

"If you bought Foo Fighters, James Bond, Venom and John Wick, right? If you bought four Stern LEs, you lost $16,000 and maybe more than that, $16,000 if you bought four Stern LEs."

Stern lost $16,000 value for buyers who purchased four recent LEs

"How did Stern Pinball come to the conclusion that we should not make back to the future? Instead, we'll make Venom. Instead, we'll make John Wick. Instead, we'll make Foo Fighters. How did they come to this conclusion?"

Stern's decision not to make Back to the Future is indicative of everything wrong with the company

"Stern is winning. They are winning, you know, on their terms. How long their win streak will last is my worry because I think their win streak is over. I think Stern has become a little bit of a one trick pony with Elwin, you know, Elwin represents 40% of their sales."

Stern is winning but becoming a one-trick pony with Keith Elwin representing 40% of sales

"They brought in a marketing consultancy. And they did focus groups with people that are young with a Gen Z audience. And they put themes in front of them because to Stern, they think the way to grow and the way to future proof their business is to focus group in age group that has no money to buy Pinball."

Stern used Gen Z focus groups to make theme decisions, which was a mistake

"The best thing to happen for spooky pinball was stern to release a $1,000 metallica topper that looks like mailed in crap. For just $300 more, you're going to get one of the coolest toppers ever"

Stern's Metallica topper makes Spooky's Evil Dead topper look like a great value

"When you see that $1,000 stern topper Metallica, they're ripping you off. When sternalees are 13,000, they're ripping you off. I'm just tired of being ripped off."

Stern is ripping customers off with pricing

"it takes most boutique companies about a year to do what Stern does in one week, and that is very impressive"

Stern manufacturing speed is impressive compared to boutiques

"Is X-Men LE twice as much fun as X-Men Pro? Does it give you twice as much in anything? No. I think everyone's waking up to that."

Stern Limited Editions are overpriced and don't provide value proportional to their cost premium

"A Stern LE should be no more than $10,500. A Stern premium should be no more than $8,500. And a Stern pro should be $6,500. And that's it. That's a fair price to me."

Fair pricing should be: Stern Pro $6,500, Premium $8,500, LE $10,500

"So that leaves Stern Pinball. And look, I think Stern Pinball is the right choice to make this game. Not only could they make the volume that the demand would require, but I also just think they've got the best talent in pinball right now."

Stern should partner with Dutch Pinball on Back to the Future instead of Jersey Jack

"even though I think that's a good thing, even though I think Stern needs to get FOMO back into pinball"

Stern creating FOMO with 500 unit Metallica LE is good for pinball

"should Stern have made a thousand of these and would that have been the right move? And I'm just going to tell you, no, I like what they did. I like that this is it. We're making 500. We're making Stern LEs a moment again. We're making them truly limited again."

Stern's move to limit Metallica remastered LE to 500 units was the right decision to make LEs special again

"How is this not remaking an LE of a game that already had an LE? This feels like a flat out lie if we were to take them at their word, that they were never going to make more LEs of a game that already had an LE. There's no loopholes. There's no context by which this now makes sense."

Stern Pinball went against their word by making more LEs of a game that already had an LE

"maybe that's the problem is everybody's tired of spending $13,000 on a stern, only to wake up in like six months, and you're seeing them for sale for $9,800"

Stern LE pricing fatigue - people tired of $13,000 LEs that drop to $9,800 in six months

"I'm gonna call it here first. I think Spike 3 is gonna be Keith Elwin's King Kong."

Spike 3 platform will debut with Keith Elwin's King Kong game